How To: Forge a 2.0L FS

[Brian MP5T]

This is not complete, I will Update with Pictures and Notes as the Engine is being rebuilt. Also, I might as well tell Edwin to post a bunch of corrections in my thread ( Because he will regardless )

As some may know, and/or not care...

I am in the process of building a spare motor for MP5T.

I wanted to post up all the information so you (The Members Of Toronto Protege) could save much time.

Contact me directly at brianmp5t@gmail.com if you have a very specific question.


Parts You Will Need, With Price.

Used Engine - Oil Pan to Valve Cover. $900.00
Forged Pistons 9:1 or 8.5:1 - CP or ARIAS. $500.00 (BORE 3.288" C.H. 1.177")
Piston Rings - with Pistons
Wrist Pin - with Pistons
Forged Rods - Olliver or Pauter MAZ-190-510-1350F $500.00
Main Bearings - OEM Mazda or Clevite MS-2057 $100.00
Rod Bearings - OEM Mazda or Clevite CB-1652P $100.00
Bearing Shims - Clevite TW-596S $30.00
Head Bolts - OEM or ARP Kit $100.00
Head Gasket - OEM or COMETIC C5844-030 $100.00
Main Bolts - OEM $100.00
Oil Sprayer - OEM (Oil Jet Under Piston ) $100.00 (This is standard/stock part on the FS Engine)
Water Pump - OEM Rebuild $100.00
Timing Belt - OEM $100.00
Valve Seals - OEM $50.00
Valve Springs - OEM $50.00
Cam Output Seals - OEM $40.00
Crank Output Seals - OEM $40.00
Oil Pump - OEM (May Not Be Required Unless High Miles)
Spark Plugs
Assembly Lube
Black Sealant
Grey Sealant

Tools Required.
(Socket, Wrenches, Hammers, Piston Ring Tool, BASIC TOOLS) Plus These Specifically.

10mm 12 Point Socket (Rod Bolts)
12mm 12 Point Socket (Main Bolts)
10mm Allen 1/2 Drive (OEM Head Bolts)
Precise Torque Wrench (Head Bolts in/Lbs)
Paint Marker Like This ... http://www.nissenmarkers.com/includes/imageRendering.jsp?productID=6&size=medium&extension=JPG

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs527.snc3/29947_10150177731830061_857595060_12542504_4130822_n.jpghttp://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs547.snc3/29947_10150177730630061_857595060_12542495_5628210_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs340.ash1/29147_10150179975725061_857595060_12608268_6152543_n.jpghttp://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs331.snc3/29147_10150180738190061_857595060_12628704_450656_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs527.snc3/29947_10150177730270061_857595060_12542490_2290283_n.jpghttp://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs340.ash1/29147_10150180837910061_857595060_12631193_5282380_n.jpg

[Brian MP5T]

-Engine Work

CLEAN (TANK)

Self Explanatory. A Bath of Nasty Chemicals which remove years of Crud and grease from the engine. A bath that prepares the engine to be machined. A Good way to start any project.

BORE

The standard bore is the width (Diameter) of the cylinder. With normal use, the cylinder will not wear very much, however, if you miss oil changes, or AUTO-X the car, you might have scoring on the cylinder walls. It is possible to Re-Bore the cylinder. Sometimes if it is required to take a bit too much metal off to get that nice round shape, an Overbore piston can be ordered, They are normally in the order of 10 or 20 THOU over. (Ten Thousand of an inch).

This is very important. If you over the cylinder and not the piston, then that 10 THOU ends up exploding on the rings that are not designed to hold pressure in that way. They eventually fail. The piston should be as tight as possible, the rings when compressed in the cylinder will almost be fully closed and make a full seal.

CRANK BALANCE

Changing the pistons and Rods, will upset the balance of the crank. It will need to be re-balanced to the new weight.

ALIGNHONE

Not always required.

The process of align honing resets the geometry of the Mains to the cylinder so that all the force is perfectly centered on the crank. This prevents crank walk and can actually increase the longevity of the motor.

The process can also be applied to the Cams.

DECK SURFACE

Fairly Obvious and easy to overlook.

Two Parts: Surface and Straightness

Surface: The Surface should be as free of damage as possible. A Fresh machined surface is the best way to set yourself for success.

Straightness: A bent block will NEVER SEAL. If it is warped, this must be done to the block to return it to a flat surface.

It is very important that this new surface is totally coverd with oil, protected by cardboard and wood for transportation.

It is equally important that the surface is totally bare just before the head gasket goes on. Brake Cleaner and a heat gun (Can cause Flame).

Apply the brake cleaner and do not use your fingers as they have oil. Let it dry or force it dry with a heat gun and very quickly place the head gasket.

HEAD SURFACE

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-8.jpg

More important than the Deck.

NOTE: The head has three wear marks, They work like a wear mark on a tire.

If the machining that must be done, goes down to that point, then the head is GARBAGE. The piston could hit the top of the head and totally damage the entire motor. Get a new head and rebuild it.

Same as before, a big blast of brake cleaner, and a heat gun, just before being placed over the head gasket.

[Brian MP5T]

- Engine Assembly

Do This Well, and Life Will not take a giant shit on your day.

Installing Oil Pump, Crank and Output Seals


Output seals are easy, you will figure it out.

Crank: Invert the engine and blast the mains with WD-40, Place half the bearings in their correct location (x5) place assembly lube and then place the crank in place.

Put the other bearings in the main caps and lube them.

Place them over the crank, but do not force them down. Install the mains bolts (I had ARP Studs for this and they torque in three stages, 40, 50, then 60 in a star pattern.

Oil pump should be primed with motor oil, pour oil in and rotate the gears. Make sure that the O-Ring is installed and seal it to the block with Grey Silicone.


Installing Pistons and Rods

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-6.jpg

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-7.jpg

The pistons and Rings should be assembled by a person who has done it before.

The pistons should be installed in pairs only, The two outside at once or the two inside at once.

Blast the machined surface of the crank, cylinder, Pistons, Rods with some sort of oil like WD-40. This is done only to get the dirt and shit off of the parts. Apply assembly lube to the surface of the piston rings and compress the piston rings in a compressor. It works well if a second set of hands hold the compressor when you tap the piston in place. If you have FIREBALL COATING, you must take special car to not mar the surface. There is a special tool to install them which is totally not required, You can normally use a fist or place a piece of Poly-U on the piston and tap it in with wood like normal.

Make sure that the piston is able to easily slide in with several small taps, rather than one big one.

Before the rod makes contact with the crank, install the rod bearings. Clean them with WD-40, then put assembly lube on the crank. Push the piston in by hand until it seats on the crank. Put the second part of the bearing in the rod cap and lightly screw in the bolts on the cap, just to hold stuff in place. Repeat this for the second piston.

If it is an APR bolt, there is Torque Grease that must be applied to the bolt to give consistent results.

My Pauter Rods came with a 50 Ft Lb torque requirement and a 12 Point bolt head.

I suggest first torquing to 40 then to 50.

Once the two are torqued, you can spin the crank to make sure there is no binding. It is normal for this to feel seized. Even with the lube on the cylinder walls, you are literally polishing the rough surface of the cylinder, and all the bearings by hand.

Installing Windage Plate and Oil Pan
More To Follow

Installing Water Pump
More To Follow

Installing Head Gasket and Head Bolts

DO NOT REUSE THE OEM BOLTS.
MAKE SURE THE BLOCK AND HEAD ARE MACHINED TRUE AND FREE OF OIL/CRAP
MAKE SURE THE HEAD GASKET IS FACING THE CORRECT WAY
DO NOT DROP THE HEAD SHARPLY ON THE GASKET, IT WILL CRUSH THE GASKET

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-9.jpg

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-11.jpg



Cylinder Head Installation Note
1. BUY NEW BOLTS FROM DEALER YOU CHEAP BASTARD (I don't give a shit what others tell you to do, they are Torque Yield Bolts, meaning they behave like a spring.
Standard length
104.2—104.8 mm {4.103—4.125 in}
Maximum length
105.5 mm {4.153 in}

2. Tighten the cylinder head bolts from center out in a star pattern. This is so that the gasket is able to lie completely flat and not bunch up during the install..

http://i48.tinypic.com/2lm7w9w.jpg

Tightening torque, NOTE THAT THIS IS A VERY TINY NUMBER, use a 10mm Allen Socket and as short of an extension as possible. The extension will make the torque wrench read LOWER than actual, use the higher 16.5 Foot pounds value. I had to convert it to Inch Ounces as that is what my small torque wrench is scaled in.

17.5—22.5 N·m 1.79—2.29 kgf·m,
From 13.0 Foot Pound To 16.5 Foot Pound

After you have torqued all 10 bolts in the proper sequence, you should verify the torque making sure not to over torque.

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-12.jpg

Get a Paint marker and precisely mark the 12 O'Clock position on all 10 bolts and let it dry for 10 min.

You should have a second person help steady the engine for the next part as it requires a fair bit of force.

With the Paint mark as a reference, Starting From 1 to 10 like before apply 90 Degrees to each bolt.
Once you have done all 10, then
Apply a second 90 Degrees to each bolt. (You Will Feel As If You Will Break The Bolt, You must apply the full 90 Degrees.)

Once done, all marks will be 180 Degrees from where they were painted, or 6 O'Clock.

Installing Cams

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-15.jpg

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-16.jpg

http://i928.photobucket.com/albums/ad121/brianmp5t/MP5T/Summer%202011/Engine%202011/Engine-17.jpg


Installing Cam Gears
More To Follow

Timing The Engine
More To Follow

[voy89]

how long could something like this take?
how much more reliable this is over stock/what can this exact setup handle?
could this be run N/A and what would be gain over stock?

[Brian MP5T]

how long could something like this take?
how much more reliable this is over stock/what can this exact setup handle?
could this be run N/A and what would be gain over stock?


-It could take less than one week if all the parts are in one place.

-I see no reason why it will be any more reliable. This type of work is done mainly to make the engine handle more HP/Boost. The basic FS Engine is the same in the MP3,Sedan,P5 and MSP. It is obvious that the FS looses all durability as soon as 200Hp is crossed. This is mainly due to the type of quality used in the connecting rods. Most of the engine design is very good, however the rods were meant for a car that had 140Hp.

-Almost no gains for N/A as the pistons are lighter but the rods weigh more. Rotating Mass will stay similar, plus the valves are still going to be stock. The Redline will not be raised, and even if it were, the engine does not get much stronger up there like some Honda engines that have the benefit of
Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control, and crazy ignition timing.

100% Not worth the money if all you want is a new/rebuilt engine for your NA Protege. You could get away likely with swapping out the bearings, Piston rings, Changing the head gasket.

[tiwing]

one could argue that better than oe quality parts and precision assembly (and the addition of oil spray) would result in a longer running engine either na or at stock boost for msps. However thats totally not the point of this... Looking forward to watching this thread.

[Brian MP5T]

Updated 11:03 25 May

[thuzil]

Any opinion on forging the crank shaft from a non-msp FSD engine, or is it already, or is this even an option?

[CrazyCaker]

Already forged.

[Brian MP5T]

Updated 1:15 AM April 29 2011